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blakes7-d Digest				Volume 99 : Issue 171

Today's Topics:
	 Re: [B7L] Character Hobbies
	 Re: [B7L] the movie
	 Re: [B7L] Character Hobbies
	 Re: [B7L] Character Hobbies
	 Re: [B7L] Character Hobbies
	 Re: [B7L] Character Hobbies
	 [B7L] quote
	 Re: [B7L] the movie
	 Re: [B7L] Those Ultra costumes...
	 Re: [B7L] Character Hobbies
	 Fwd: Re: [B7L] Character Hobbies
	 [B7L] Avon
	 [B7L] Vila words
	 Re: OT: BACs (was Re: [B7L] Worst Openings)
	 Re: [B7L] Character Hobbies
	 Fwd: Re: OT: BACs (was Re: [B7L] Worst Openings)
	 Fwd: Re: [B7L] Character Hobbies
	 Re: [B7L] the movie
	 Re: [B7L] Vila words
	 Re: [B7L] the movie
	 Re: Fwd: Re: OT: BACs (was Re: [B7L] Worst Openings)

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 06:54:51 EDT
From: Mac4781@aol.com
To: Blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Character Hobbies
Message-ID: <e9a2beef.2476957b@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Joanne wrote:

> Makes Avon's interest, erm, "interesting", doesn't it?
>  <smile>

It does indeed.  But was his admiring glance aimed at the person
or at his/her outfit? <g>
  
>  Well, I have heard AFL developed as a winter sport for
>  cricket players - if the Godmother can imagine her boy
>  playing cricket, 

I do like an image of Tarrant in the white uniform. 

>then she may be able to imagine him
>  playing Aussie Rules. Better still, from the point of
>  view of the Tarrant Nostra - the local branch of that
>  institution should tell Carol about the shorts

Shorts... sigh...   That's convinced me that he must play soccer, at least in 
scrub matches. 

>  (although, Heaven help Tarrant if they were the 1980s
>  Warwick Capper variety!).

You can't throw out tantalizing teases like that without a demand for more 
information.  What is a Warwick Capper?

>  <smile> May I suggest Bayban the Boxer. Just one small
>  step away from Bayban the Butcher.

Good one!

Carol Mc

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 12:09:20 +0100
From: "Una McCormack" <una@q-research.connectfree.co.uk>
To: <Blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] the movie
Message-ID: <00bd01bea37c$ed4b2670$0c01a8c0@hedge>
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

 Joanne wrote:

> (thankyou, Alison, for saving us from alliteration
> overload)

Tho' I can't resist pinching the one about Tarrant from the Enarrare
collection:

'Too tiresome to tolerate - terminate!'


Una

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 09:15:56 EDT
From: VulcanXYZ@aol.com
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Character Hobbies
Message-ID: <85e4fc0c.2476b68c@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
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In a message dated 5/19/99 5:40:25 PM Central Daylight Time, 
mistral@ptinet.net writes:

<< What hobbies would you give to various characters? >>

I would like to see Avon match wits with Spock on that 3-dimensional chess 
game that the Vulcan was so found of playing.  Who would win, do you think?

Gail

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 06:12:11 -0700 (PDT)
From: J MacQueen <jomacqueen@yahoo.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Character Hobbies
Message-ID: <19990521131211.15852.rocketmail@web901.mail.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

--- Mac4781@aol.com wrote:
> I do like an image of Tarrant in the white uniform. 

Pleased to be of service <smile>

> Shorts... sigh...   That's convinced me that he must
> play soccer, at least in scrub matches. 

Yes, I thought something like that might be the case.
 
> >  (although, Heaven help Tarrant if they were the
> >1980s Warwick Capper variety!).
> You can't throw out tantalizing teases like that
> without a demand for more information.  What is a   
> Warwick Capper?

Never having been a Melbournite, I know of this 1980s
vintage AFL player by reputation more than anything
else. The point is that the shorts concerned were very
short and very tight (Capper's image was that of a
himbo). This may not be to your taste, Carol! I'm
thinking particularly of the fact that dear Tarrant
might have to sing soprano afterwards <smile>

Regards
Joanne



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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 10:11:19 EDT
From: Tigerm1019@aol.com
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Character Hobbies
Message-ID: <c3171648.2476c387@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
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In a message dated 99-05-21 09:18:17 EDT, VulcanXYZ@aol.com writes:

<< I would like to see Avon match wits with Spock on that 3-dimensional chess 
 game that the Vulcan was so found of playing.  Who would win, do you think?
  >>

Spock, without a doubt.

Tiger M

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 11:12:21 -0400
From: Susan Beth <sbs@world.std.com>
To: blake7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Character Hobbies
Message-Id: <3.0.4.32.19990521111221.00747908@world.std.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Tigerm1019@aol.com wrote:
>In a message dated 99-05-21 09:18:17 EDT, VulcanXYZ@aol.com writes:
>
><< I would like to see Avon match wits with Spock on that 3-dimensional
chess 
> game that the Vulcan was so found of playing.  Who would win, do you think?
>  >>
>
>Spock, without a doubt.

Don't be too sure.  Remember, Kirk used to beat Spock.  

(Of course, Kirk outranked Spock. Hmmmm.)


Susan Beth


(sbs@world.std.com)

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 15:39:47 +0100 (BST)
From: Judith Proctor <Judith@blakes-7.demon.co.uk>
To: Lysator List <Blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: [B7L] quote
Message-ID: <Marcel-1.46-0521143947-ab5Rr9i@blakes-7.demon.co.uk>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII

I found a quote by a chap called anon the other day, but it feels just like
something Servalan could have said.

"Power corrupts, but absolute power is absolutely delightful."

Judith
-- 
http://www.hermit.org/Blakes7 -  Fanzines for Blake's 7, B7 Filk songs,
pictures, news, Conventions past and present, Blake's 7 fan clubs, Gareth
Thomas, etc.  (also non-Blake's 7 zines at http://www.nas.com/~lknight)

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 10:12:59 +0100 (BST)
From: Judith Proctor <Judith@blakes-7.demon.co.uk>
To: Lysator List <Blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] the movie
Message-ID: <Marcel-1.46-0521091259-313Rr9i@blakes-7.demon.co.uk>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII

On Thu 20 May, Kevin Mahoney wrote:
> Judith Proctor wrote:
> 
> >Makes sense.  They're bound to redesign everything from uniforms to logos, 
> >so having a rationale for that does make sense.  Either a corrupt democracy
> >or one that has fallen to totalitarianism.
> 
> I don't think the Federation would change uniform design too much, no matter
> how much trouble it's in (especially as it's a symbol of terror).  I believe
> the basic concepts of the Roman empire lasted for centuries, with very
> little change in army uniform or tremendous advances in technology.  So,
> although the Federation may have started out as technologically progessive,
> as the dictatorship set in, this progress may well have stagnated.  Orac
> might still be ahead of the class after 20 years.

I was thinking of the fact that movies always tend to redesign things.  I got
resigned to Star Trek's constant uniform changes.

Although details of the Roman army may have stayed constant for a long time,
modern governments do tend to have much faster turnover of uniform styles.  Look
at changes in the last decade of uniform within the ambulance and fire services
to take just two radical examples.  I'm no expert on military uniforms, but I do
know that they have quite a significant rate of change too.  (Actually, if
anyone is really intersted, I've a friend who is very deeply into military
uniforms and their change and development over time.  I could always pick her
brains as to how often major style changes in uniform tend to occur)  If you
think back to the first world war, then uniforms were very different from the
second world war.  Modern uniforms have changed again - think of urban camoflage
gear as an example.

Changes in fighting styles, the introduction of new fabrics, different styles of
weapons, all these can affect military clothing.

I'd actually like to see a change in the helmets.  They look good because they
make the wearer seem very inhuman and they seem to have some kind of integral
gas mask, but the green band seems to serve no purpose that I can think of. 
Helmets look menacing - 'Knights of God' used the same trick.

I think a black uniform is good and I'd like to see the Federation logo
retained, but the uniform was basically a 'one size fits all extras' coverall. 
Tarting it up a bit and making more use of rank insignia, unit badges etc. would
surely do no harm?

Judith
-- 
http://www.hermit.org/Blakes7 -  Fanzines for Blake's 7, B7 Filk songs,
pictures, news, Conventions past and present, Blake's 7 fan clubs, Gareth
Thomas, etc.  (also non-Blake's 7 zines at http://www.nas.com/~lknight)

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 18:36:43 +0100 (BST)
From: Judith Proctor <Judith@blakes-7.demon.co.uk>
To: Lysator List <Blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: [B7L] Those Ultra costumes...
Message-ID: <Marcel-1.46-0521173643-354Rr9i@blakes-7.demon.co.uk>
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII

On Fri 21 May, David Davis wrote:
> I was reading in "the inside story" about those Ultra costumes (you know, 
> where they're designed to look like skin with big veins that blend 
> seamlessly into the actors necks, but it's really just appalingly obvious 
> that they're wearing blue bodysuits with their face and neck plastered with 
> blue make-up, with veins drawn in...)
>   I guess it was kinda gratifying to find out how embarrassed the production 
> team were about it too... proof that everyone on that show was trying their 
> darndest to make a quality programme.
>   But I was left a bit confused in this case just what they were trying to  
> do? Nicky the designer Gucci wellies designer apparently wanted to have 
> plastic veins coming out of the costume and tapering into their skin, stuck 
> on (presumeably so that there was no obvious join, at the collar).... would 
> seem to make sense, but then Sheelagh said they would just come off if the 
> actors moved their necks...
>   So what was the best way to have done it? Surely there must've been *some* 
> way to have veiny-neck-continuity...  I can't really see how make up could 
> ever look convincingly like it was part of a costume (or conversely how a 
> costume could look like it was skin)

I seem to recall Sheelagh saying that it could have been done if the costumes
had cut off at the bottom of the neck.  The problem with them going up in a
collar is that the actor can twist his neck too far relative to the collar.  If
the join is lower down, there is less relative movement and the make up can be
flexible enough to cover the join.

Imagine a rubber 'vein' if you will and then mentally pipe it on like icing
sugar from costume to skin.  In one case, it will stay put, in the other it will
break when the actor moves.

Judith
-- 
http://www.hermit.org/Blakes7 -  Fanzines for Blake's 7, B7 Filk songs,
pictures, news, Conventions past and present, Blake's 7 fan clubs, Gareth
Thomas, etc.  (also non-Blake's 7 zines at http://www.nas.com/~lknight)

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 18:57:57 +0100
From: Julia Jones <julia.lysator@jajones.demon.co.uk>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Cc: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Character Hobbies
Message-ID: <4YEuiBAl6ZR3Ew6L@jajones.demon.co.uk>

In message <bf467d41.247601ae@aol.com>, Mac4781@aol.com writes
>I'm not familiar with rugby, but it brings to mind an image of solid bodies 
>impacting with great force.  Definitely best to leave that to Blake. 

My reading was interrupted at this point by memories of a certain
Welshman's reaction to being informed during a con of the Five Nations
result:-))
-- 
Julia Jones
"Don't philosophise with me, you electronic moron!"
        The Turing test - as interpreted by Kerr Avon.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 16:36:08 PDT
From: "Sally Manton" <smanton@hotmail.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Fwd: Re: [B7L] Character Hobbies
Message-ID: <19990521233608.85666.qmail@hotmail.com>
Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed;

Mistral wrote:
>
> > What hobbies would you give to various characters?
>      <many snips>
> >  Tarrant: Football,
>
>Let's hope he sticks to scrub matches.  His skinny neck would snap the 
>first
>time he was seriously tackled at competitive levels of the sport.  (Or is
>that what you had in mind when you gave him this particular hobby? ;-)
>

Maybe he could be guided into something along the lines of Australian Rules 
Football (speaking as someone who tells the games apart with extreme 
difficulty, but still...) There's much less of the crunching and more 
running and *very* impressive high jumping to take the mark (technical 
language here <g>)- and therefore long, tall bodies fit in rather 
well...also I imagine the Nostra wouldn't mind the standard outfit of 
sleeveless vest and short, short shorts

Sally


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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 16:50:18 PDT
From: "Sally Manton" <smanton@hotmail.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] Avon
Message-ID: <19990521235018.66004.qmail@hotmail.com>
Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed;

Judith wrote: <If you had to describe the things that you like about Avon 
and were only allowed five adjectives, which would they be? I think I'd go 
for intelligent, vulnerable, loyal, sexy and witty (in no particular order)>

And Sondra replied : <My 5 adjectives for Avon: Honest, strong-willed, 
inner-directed, competent and loyal. Now, would anyone like to try Blake?  
I'll go first: Altruistic, courageous, compassionate, single-minded and 
shrewd.>

Five?  Five???  No, but I did get it down to six for each...
Avon...Arrogant, intelligent, ruthless, stubborn, vulnerable, 
gorgeous...couldn't knock any of them out.

And Blake? Arrogant, intelligent, ruthless (something a trend here <g>) 
warm, passionate *and* compassionate.


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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 18:26:42 PDT
From: "Sally Manton" <smanton@hotmail.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: [B7L] Vila words
Message-ID: <19990522012645.24988.qmail@hotmail.com>
Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed;

Mistral wrote:

<Let's have five words for Vila's good qualities, too.>

Ummm...how about just five words for Vila (since his most striking qualities 
aren't all that good, though oddly endearing...)

Lazy, cowardly, selfish, humorous, candid.(The last one *was* going to be 
honest, but only about himself, poor dear...)


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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 22:39:53 EDT
From: Tigerm1019@aol.com
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: OT: BACs (was Re: [B7L] Worst Openings)
Message-ID: <bb4dbfd6.247772f9@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 99-05-20 02:48:07 EDT, stephendate@hotmail.com writes:

<< I think that's slightly unfair to Blake. Blake is ruthless, 
 determined and very, very bossy but then he is fighting a facist 
 dictatorship. Successful revolutionaries tend not to start their 
 speeches with the words "On the one hand, in a very real sense...". 
 He retains a sense of humour and a capacity for self criticism
 (in Trial to take the most conspicuous example), neither of which are 
 common among religious fanatics. I have to say I think Blake would be 
 attracted to Liberation Theology or the Social Gospel, rather than 
 pestering complete strangers asking if they've been saved.
  >>

Stephen, I think you're absolutely right about this one.  

Blake is very much a revolutionary leader who is out to change the social 
system, but he's not a wild-eyed fanatic, even at Star One.  He had a very 
real chance of bringing down the Federation there and it was just about his 
only chance.  I think he carefully considered all of his options and made his 
decision.  

I'm with you in thinking he would be attracted to Liberation Theology or the 
Social Gospel.  His goal was to change the society he lived in, not to 
convert the entire universe to his way of thinking.  If he had been of the 
everybody-has-to-agree-with-me-or-else mindset, he'd have booted Avon off the 
Liberator within a week.

Tiger M

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 12:59:07 -0600
From: "Ellynne G." <rilliara@juno.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Character Hobbies
Message-ID: <19990514.125917.10270.0.Rilliara@juno.com>

On Fri, 21 May 1999 10:11:19 EDT Tigerm1019@aol.com writes:
>In a message dated 99-05-21 09:18:17 EDT, VulcanXYZ@aol.com writes:
>
><< I would like to see Avon match wits with Spock on that 
>3-dimensional chess 
> game that the Vulcan was so found of playing.  Who would win, do you 
>think?
>  >>
>
>Spock, without a doubt.
>
>Tiger M
>
Hmm, assuming Avon would play fair, aren't you?

Ellynne

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------------------------------

Date: Sat, 22 May 1999 00:39:27 PDT
From: "Sally Manton" <smanton@hotmail.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Fwd: Re: OT: BACs (was Re: [B7L] Worst Openings)
Message-ID: <19990522073928.98567.qmail@hotmail.com>
Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed;

After Stephe wrote:



>From: Tigerm1019@aol.com
>To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
>Subject: Re: OT: BACs (was Re: [B7L] Worst Openings)
>Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 22:39:53 EDT
>
>In a message dated 99-05-20 02:48:07 EDT, stephendate@hotmail.com writes:

<I think that's slightly unfair to Blake...I have to say I think Blake would 
be attracted to Liberation Theology or the Social Gospel, rather than 
pestering complete strangers asking if they've been saved.

TigerM replied:

<Stephen, I think you're absolutely right about this one. Blake is very much 
a revolutionary leader who is out to change the social system, but he's not 
a wild-eyed fanatic, even at Star One.  He had a very real chance of 
bringing down the Federation there and it was just about his only chance.  I 
think he carefully considered all of his options and made his decision.>

Well, you've all heard *my* views on that. I agree with Tiger M on this 
point. I think he's driven, but neither obsessive nor fanatic. And he has a 
sense of the ridiculous, something most fanatics of any sort wouldn't 
recognise if it bit them.

<I'm with you in thinking he would be attracted to Liberation Theology or 
the Social Gospel.  His goal was to change the society he lived in, not to 
convert the entire universe to his way of thinking.  If he had been of the 
everybody-has-to-agree-with-me-or-else mindset, he'd have booted Avon off 
the Liberator within a week.>

Haven't heard of either of these (my little corner of the world seems to 
stick to the more usual (aka conservative) religious denominations. But what 
*I* can see for Blake is practical missionary work. He'd be in the worst of 
it in the darkest and bloodiest wars of Darkest Africa, or in Kosovo, 
risking his neck to save their bodies *and* souls.


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Date: Sat, 22 May 1999 00:47:20 PDT
From: "Sally Manton" <smanton@hotmail.com>
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Fwd: Re: [B7L] Character Hobbies
Message-ID: <19990522074720.25025.qmail@hotmail.com>
Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed;

>On Fri, 21 May 1999 10:11:19 EDT Tigerm1019@aol.com writes:
> >In a message dated 99-05-21 09:18:17 EDT, VulcanXYZ@aol.com writes:
> >
> ><< I would like to see Avon match wits with Spock on that
> >3-dimensional chess
> > game that the Vulcan was so found of playing.  Who would win, do you
> >think?
> >  >>
> >
> >Spock, without a doubt.
> >
> >Tiger M

Ellyne replied:
<Hmm, assuming Avon would play fair, aren't you?>

True, true. I've always believed that both he *and* Vila cheated in their 
matches, maybe because in the first each automatically assumed the other was 
going to.



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------------------------------

Date: Sat, 22 May 1999 04:04:04 EDT
From: AdamWho@aol.com
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] the movie
Message-ID: <36260c78.2477bef4@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 99-05-19 21:43:20 EDT, N.Faulkner@tesco.net writes:

<< Here I disagree totally.  Scrap the lame old series theme and bring in a
 pulsing techno soundtrack.  And definitely no epic Horneresque orchestral
 pieces. >>

I'd like a new theme that is creative, distinctive, but not completely 
different than the original. Basically, the producers should just 
watch\listen to the opening credits of the Dr. Who tv-movie, and do the exact 
opposite of what they did. 

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 22 May 1999 04:09:12 EDT
From: AdamWho@aol.com
To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] Vila words
Message-ID: <f729184.2477c028@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 99-05-20 12:23:36 EDT, mistral@ptinet.net writes:

<< Let's have five words for Vila's good qualities, too.
 My submission:
 
 Loyal, resilient, playful, clever, open. >>

Five words describing Vila.......
reluctant
underrated
friendly
resourceful
humorous

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 22 May 1999 04:18:11 EDT
From: AdamWho@aol.com
To: Blakes7@lysator.liu.se
Subject: Re: [B7L] the movie
Message-ID: <6bd40a79.2477c243@aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 99-05-20 13:40:21 EDT, Judith@blakes-7.demon.co.uk writes:

<< Disagree strongly.  I loved the flambouyant costumes.  A real hallmark of 
the
 series.  (Though I think I preferred Barbara Lane's stuff overall) >>

If the choice is between the strange outfits seen on B7 and the bland 
uniforms everyone has to wear on some of the Trek shows, I'd rather see the 
strange outfits. At the very least, they are amusing and get attention 
(exception: Cally's green horrors in The Web and Redemption. May cause 
permanent eye damage on initial viewing). 

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 22 May 1999 04:57:28 -0700
From: mistral@ptinet.net
To: B7 List <blakes7@lysator.liu.se>
Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: OT: BACs (was Re: [B7L] Worst Openings)
Message-ID: <37469BA8.64D6E142@ptinet.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Sally Manton wrote:

> But what
> *I* can see for Blake is practical missionary work. He'd be in the worst of
> it in the darkest and bloodiest wars of Darkest Africa, or in Kosovo,
> risking his neck to save their bodies *and* souls.

Yes, actually, I can agree with this completely. I wouldn't
say, however, that this required less commitment to the
faith than walking up to strangers and asking them if they're
saved; actually, it would seem to require *more* commitment.
And I *didn't* say he would be obsessive or fanatical-- only
committed. He is, after all, an idealist <g>.

Mistral
--
"If the ship's blown up, lofty disinterest won't save you."--Blake

--------------------------------
End of blakes7-d Digest V99 Issue #171
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