From: blakes7-d-request@lysator.liu.se Subject: blakes7-d Digest V98 #105 X-Loop: blakes7-d@lysator.liu.se X-Mailing-List: archive/volume98/105 Precedence: list MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/digest; boundary="----------------------------" To: blakes7-d@lysator.liu.se Reply-To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se ------------------------------ Content-Type: text/plain blakes7-d Digest Volume 98 : Issue 105 Today's Topics: [B7L] More on Julia Jones re. DELIVERANCE Re: [B7L] Star spotting Re: [B7L] mutoids Re: [B7L] filking etc. [B7L] Sorry to post this to the list... [B7L] Registered mail Re: [B7L] Registered mail [B7L] Tapping bracelet button... [B7L] Deliverance pros & cons [B7L] Phoenix, Witching Ways Re: [B7L] Tapping bracelet button... Re: [B7L] DSV 1 or 2 Re: [B7L] DSV 1 or 2 Re: [B7L] Good news and bad news Re: [B7L] Deliverance pros & cons Re: [B7L] Star spotting Re: [B7L] Star spotting [B7L] Too hot Re: [B7L] Too hot Re: [B7L] Star spotting [B7L] Con-structive criticism Re: [B7L] Deliverance pros & cons Re: [B7L] More on Julia Jones re. DELIVERANCE Re: [B7L] Good news and bad news [B7L] It's too hot in here for me [B7L] Chaos Re: [B7L] More on Julia Jones re. DELIVERANCE [B7L] Re: Heavy drinking and sleep deprivation - the key to a great weekend [B7L] Deliverance RE: [B7L] Star spotting ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 06 Apr 1998 23:30:12 +0100 From: JMR To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: [B7L] More on Julia Jones re. DELIVERANCE Message-Id: <3.0.2.32.19980406233012.00699e74@clara.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >>Julia Jones writes: >> > >> I suppose we can only wait for the convention video to prove this >>one way or another. >This is why the comment "I was tired". It's quite possible I misheard. >But at least two other people remarked on it in my hearing, which is why >I thought it might not be just me. > I think the message from Lucy Collin backs up my assurance that I did thank the stewards. However, since my "thank you" list was so long, it's possible that people didn't actually pick up on the stewards' thankyou. Sorry for that. But I DID thank them - honest. >I greatly enjoyed much of the con, and there are certainly many things >to praise. Blessings on the person who decided on the lanyard system, it >made it so much easier to spot badges and day colour, and made life so >much more difficult for the pests who enjoy getting attention by >deliberately hiding their badges. (Another steward's comment, the >latter, not mine). Judith Smith's idea, I believe. The wonderful exhibition. Actually seeing so many of >the people involved. I know that with that many guests and members, more >things than usual will go wrong. It's impossible to have something on >that scale run smoothly. But I also saw evidence of the attitude that >Kathryn described as officious inefficiency, Someone out there give me a solid example of "officious inefficiency", please. Then I can comment, explain or apologise. "Officious"? Who? When? Under what circumstances? >and a great many little >things that seemd trivial in themselves, but built up into an overall >impression that the left hand knew not what the right hand was doing. >-- >Julia Jones > I will reiterate that this sort of "impression" was in no way unique to "Deliverance". Consider the following "Departments" that go into running a convention like both W7 and Del'nce: Hotel Liaison, Registrations, Programming, Operations, Events, Stewarding, Merchandising, Advertising, Technical, Guest Liaison, Programme Items, Fan Panels, Workshops, Childrens Programme, Video Programme etc, all of which require a number of staff, and all of which were run by seperate teams of volunteers, overseen by the ConCom. Consider the amount of liaison required between these different departments. Prior to the convention, every department was aware of their jurisdiction and responsibilities, had attended the relevant meetings, and were confident they could proceed successfully. In an ideal world, where no unexpected factors came into play, there would have been no problems at all. However, how often do any of us come across situations where no problems arise? At the event, Department Managers, or whatever you choose to call them, could not go to the ConCom on every single occasion that a problem cropped up. They did, and were expected to, use their initiative. Thus, it happens that because someone has taken an "on the spot" decision, with no time for discussion, that others will be unaware of this decision until the decision-taker has a moment to inform Operations, and therefore everyone else. Imagine a scenario: Guest "A" finds it impossible to do programme item "X", though has, until the very last minute, had every intention of doing it. This decision reaches the ConCom, via Guest Liaison, minutes before item "X" is due to start. Consider the organisational nightmare that then follows. Operations has to be notified, who then notify all those with radios. The ConCom have to make a decision on cancellation or replacement. Other Guest Liaisons have to be informed, as do the Tech crew, the MC, the Events Managers etc. For a few minutes there is, of course, a chaotic frenzy as a solution is found and implemented. The important point, however, is that 750+ attendees are not faced with an empty hall, or faced with being told "Sorry, nothing's happening now". Believe me, such moments are heart-stopping, and if anyone has been in or passing Operations when the ConCom is desperately playing "rewrite the programme", they would truly see blind panic. This does not equate to incompetence, and it is hardly surprising that such "on-the-spot" changes and decisions don't immediately reach every last member of staff. Previously, Julia wrote: >I've never seen one >(a convention)> that was such a shambles as this. Some of it was >down to being over-ambitious, for which people can't be blamed, given >the occasion, some of it was "act of god" (keycards springs to mind), >but some of it I can't see any reason for other than sheer incompetance. >I don't know what went wrong, because many of the people involved were >also involved in running another con I've been to, which is one of the >benchmarks I'm using for how a con *should* go. > Whilst I am willing to take responsibility for any problems that occured at "Deliverance", I refuse to accept that any of my staff (and I say "my" because mainly staffing was within my jurisdiction, not Diane's or Judith Smith's) were incompetent. Hard-working, enthusiastic, diligent, over-worked and good-humoured, yes, but "incompetent"? I think not. I, and "Deliverance" as a whole, are very lucky to have such a number of loyal and committed friends, all of whom volunteered, to provide staff for the event. Any con-runner knows that finding trustworthy and dependable staff is half the battle. I won't allow those people to take criticism for spending a great deal of time, money and effort to ensure that so many people had a good time. I do take exception to the comment: >I've never seen one >(a convention)> that was such a shambles as this. I can only assume that Julia has either a) a limited experience of conventions or b) has very little idea of the amount of organisation that has to go into a "multi-stream" programme. It is interesting that much general comment has been made of things such as the cabaret over-running (mea culpa), but very little of all the other programme items that ran successfully. Yes, "Deliverance" wasn't without it's share of problems, but at how many other conventions can the same be levelled? Personally, I feel that "a shambles" can best be applied to a convention where guests fail to attend, the majority of programme items are cancelled, attendees are bored and discontented, and the staff are on the verge of mutiny. I can think of one B7 convention in the early '90s that this would apply to, but I hardly think "Deliverance" compares. A few days before "Deliverance", I commented to my ConCom colleagues, "On Thursday morning, we'll hit the ground running, and we won't stop running until Monday night." I was right. ------------------------ Re: The Exhibition Major contributors of props, costumes etc were: Cathy & Paul Holroyd, Rob Emery & Jackie Ophir, Andrew Beech and Andy Hopkinson. There were other "lenders", but the above provided the bulk of the stuff. Martin Bower and Mat Irvine were also kind enough to loan exhibits. Andy Hopkinson and Rob Emery did the lions' share of setting up the Exhbition, both before and during the event. Andy Hopkinson also built the "Liberator" set that was used in the main hall. Rob Emery wrote the catalogue. ------------------------- Comments? Judith J.M. Rolls jager@clara.net ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 06 Apr 1998 16:57:12 -0800 From: Helen Krummenacker To: Rob Clother CC: B7 mailing list Subject: Re: [B7L] Star spotting Message-ID: <352979E8.678@jps.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Rob Clother wrote: > > > AVON still rules Blake's 7!!!!! > > Oh dear, yet another deluded soul. Blake rules Blake's 7. Everyone knows > that. :-) Yeh. That's why he misplaced his ship and crew for years, ended up having no notion who he could trust on the worst planet in the Federation and got shot up my his former 2nd in command. Great rulership. ;) (kidding, kidding!) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 06 Apr 1998 17:01:29 -0800 From: Helen Krummenacker To: Reuben Herfindahl CC: Judith Proctor , Lysator List Subject: Re: [B7L] mutoids Message-ID: <35297AE9.209B@jps.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Reuben Herfindahl wrote: > > -----Original Message----- > From: Judith Proctor > To: Lysator List > Date: Monday, April 06, 1998 3:11 PM > Subject: [B7L] mutoids > > >If mutoids lived on blood serum, why was it green? > > > > It was blood serum, and not pure blood, perhaps a chemical additive was > added that made the color appear green. Also there is no suggestion that > the blood need be oxygenated, that would lead to a darker red, not green, > but perhaps in combination with another chemical it turned green. > > Just some off the wall ideas. "Damnit, Jim! I'm an IS specialist, not a > doctor." Leading to my own suggestion, the mutoids don't use human blood as often as Vulcan blood. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 06 Apr 1998 17:28:11 -0800 From: Helen Krummenacker To: Judith Proctor CC: Lysator List Subject: Re: [B7L] filking etc. Message-ID: <3529812B.1F1D@jps.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Fan panels are a favourite of mine and I think it's a shame that more people > don't go to them (although if programmed against a guest talk, it is > understandable that people who haven't seen that guest before will choose the > guest talk) I've been to some beauties over the years. Some had as few as > three participants (but we were enjoying ourselves, so we didn't care) and some > had nearly a hundred. The joy of a fan panel is that the people running it are > experts. Guests, with rare exceptions, do not know their own show terribly > well. They will recall their own part, but they won't have thought about the > alien culture, starship design, mariage rituals, character's past history, etc. > Fans on the other hand can give you five different ways in which Avon could have > survived Gauda Prime without even pausing for breath. At a fan panel, you can > chuck in your own contributions, mention the sixth and seventh ways in which he > might have survived, point out the fatal flaw in the argument for method number > two and generally have fun arguing about topics that you can never discuss > outside of a convention atmosphere Hmmmm. Sounds like this mailing list, only done in real time. :) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 19:51:10 -0600 (MDT) From: Robin Peacock To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: [B7L] Sorry to post this to the list... Message-Id: <199804070151.TAA13457@nyx.nyx.net> I know it's poor netiquette to ask the list how to get off the list, but I've sent several unsubscribe messages and keep getting informed that I haven't been removed because it can't find my name on the list...Meanwhile, my mailbox continues to get swamped with messages I'd love to read but just haven't got time for... Anybody know which Tarriel Cell I need to hook up to in order to straighten this out? PS--I love Vila too! Thanks! RMP ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 06 Apr 98 18:39:36 EST From: fortune@mauimail.com To: Friend@public.com Subject: [B7L] Registered mail Message-ID: <> You just stumbled upon something big ! Pt or FT No competition ! No selling ! Not MLM ! $1 - $5,000 per week from home, within 30 days ! Daily conference calls ! Complete training and support ! Leads available ! Dear Friend, If your tired of the hype , then read on. Everyone wants more and we have the system that can get it. Over 20,000 doctors, lawyers, CPA's and business people, last year alone, started using our system to create wealth in their spare time. Many are making in excess of $50,000 per month. Speak to them yourself ! " I'm a chiropractor in Hawaii and use this system in my spare time to consistently make over $4,000 per week ! " Michael F. Makawao, HI " I'm a single nurse and mom with 5 kids, have been using the system for 18 months, and last year alone, earned $400,000 ! " Melissa F., Parkersburg, IA " I was a practicing priest for many years, retired and started using this system. Last week I earned $33,000 and bought my wife a new van - CASH " Jim P., Port Angeles, WA These people were taught how to turn a one time investment into big money ! Is the timing right for you ? Find out on our discovery call. Risk free and pressure free ! We guarantee it ! 888 354 3187 To have your name removed form our list, send an email with remove in subject to remove.org. We filter against all universal remove lists. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 07 Apr 1998 12:35:04 +1000 From: Bill Billingsley To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: Re: [B7L] Registered mail Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980407123504.006b263c@rabbit> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 18:39 6/04/98 EST, fortune@mauimail.com (allegedly) wrote: >You just stumbled upon something big ! Well, since they chose to spam us with a US-only mystery-offer, how's abouts we sign them up as recipients of every mailing list we can think of, (including these perhaps)... see how they feel about off-topic rubbish being force fed to them... What do you think? -------------------------------------------------------- The Loch Mess Monster (occaisionally mistaken as Bill Billingsley) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 06 Apr 1998 19:10:00 -0800 From: Helen Krummenacker To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: [B7L] Tapping bracelet button... Message-ID: <35299907.2A94@jps.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Tramila, are you there? I've missed you on the mailing list... obviously my sights need adjustment. -- Avona ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Apr 98 03:49:00 GMT From: s.thompson8@genie.geis.com To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: [B7L] Deliverance pros & cons Message-Id: <199804070406.EAA08113@rock103.genie.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I had a fabulously good time at Deliverance, but that doesn't mean I think it was the perfect con. Not that any con ever is, but some are better run than others. FWIW, I would rate Deliverance in about the middle range of cons I have attended in terms of general organization-- pretty good, but could have been better. The comparisons are from over twenty years of attending literary SF conventions, plus six years now of media conventions. To give an idea of the quality range, in terms of cons that the Deliverance folks may have attended, the WorldCon in Glasgow in '95 would be near the top of my personal rankings, and the Brighton one of '87 would be near the bottom (though it wasn't as bad as the New Orleans one, an organizational disaster redeemed only by its wonderful location). I'd put Deliverance in between, maybe a bit toward the high end. Comparing it to the last media con I attended, Visions in Chicago last November, I'd say that in general Deliverance did a much better job with the big events but did not handle the smaller events or the overall organization as well. Good points, from the viewpoint of an attendee who knew nothing about the inner workings of the con: 1) By far the best name tags I've ever seen at a con. Legible, convenient, and didn't damage clothes. A great blessing for e-mail acquaintances trying to identify each other. Here's hoping that other cons will copy them. 2) The MC for the events in the main hall was excellent, one of the best I've seen at a con. Kudos to him. 3) The technical aspects of the presentation in the main hall were also very good. I was impressed. If the con videos correspond to what we saw on the big screen during the actual events, they should be excellent. 4) The cabaret with the guests was the best of its kind that I've ever seen. Very enjoyable. (For selfish reasons, I personally was glad of the late start; I thought I had missed the costume competition altogether and was delighted that I hadn't after all.) 5) The con publications-- souvenir brochure, program guide, fiction zine, exhibition catalogue-- were all extremely well done, and the ones not included in the registration package were reasonably priced. The mugs, T-shirts, and other souvenir items were nice too. 6) A very satisfactory hotel-- comfortable rooms, courteous and friendly staff, restaurant food acceptable in both taste and price. (However, I wonder whether a shortage of suitable secondary function rooms may have contributed to problem [1] below.) Also, the hotel reservation system seemed to be unusually well handled, especially considering that there was a change of venue at a relatively late date. I am deeply grateful to Judith Smith for efficiently straightening out some complications with my own reservation. It was a happy contrast to the nightmare of trying to get a hotel room in Baltimore for the upcoming WorldCon (although in the end I decided not to go to that for other, unrelated reasons). Bad points, in two broad categories: 1) The overcrowding and resulting confusion for program events not held in the main hall, and the ticketing system for them. I avoided all such events precisely because I didn't want to have to deal with the hassle, so I don't really know the details; but everyone seems to agree that there were problems in this respect that could have been better handled. 2) The attitude of some of the con personnel, before, during, and after. For instance, the person I tried to say thanks to as I was leaving on Sunday snapped at me. Yes, I understand that the concom were all horrendously busy, but many people do manage to maintain basic courtesy even under stress. It was a minor incident, but it left a bad taste, as does this business of pseudonymous and overly personal flaming of anyone who criticizes the con. (I've been wondering whether "Diva" is the same person who snapped at me for trying to say "thank you." There's a certain similarity of tone.) Not to mention the fact that, after all the hoopla over whether or under what conditions zines with adult material would be permitted at the con-- which I'm told resulted in some dealers whose wares I would have liked to examine deciding not to come, as they couldn't get reliable information about what the rules actually were-- Horizon was then selling its own adult zine under the table! I don't like pseudonymous flaming in general. I didn't like it last fall when someone on this list was attacking the Deliverance concom's policies under a pseudonym. "Diva's" policy of responding to criticisms with ad hominem attacks on the critics is something I find very disturbing. It reminds me unpleasantly of what I considered to be some of the bad points of the con, even though, as I hope I've made clear, those were far outweighed by the good points. Sarah Thompson ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Apr 98 06:13:00 GMT From: s.thompson8@genie.geis.com To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: [B7L] Phoenix, Witching Ways Message-Id: <199804070636.GAA18378@rock103.genie.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Narrelle, I'm delighted to hear that Phoenix 4 is done. I hope no one will want to see me during my office hours tomorrow, so that I can go web crawling instead. And tell us more about your book, please. Is this a pro novel? If so, has it been published yet? Is it SF? Fantasy? Something else? And what, exactly, is the prize that it's up for? This all sounds very exciting. Sarah Thompson ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 07 Apr 1998 00:07:24 -0700 From: Tramila To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: Re: [B7L] Tapping bracelet button... Message-Id: <3.0.2.32.19980407000724.006d0488@earthlink.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Avona wrote: >Tramila, are you there? > >I've missed you on the mailing list... obviously my sights need >adjustment. Thanks for asking about me Avona. I've had a heavy schedule lately but this week is spring break. Just finished watching Space Fall. Have TV on Computer now. Can do both at same time. hehehehehe ok Hopefully, I can answer some of my mail tomorrow. Just to let you know. Pat P. told me that you guys were having a flame war. I, hopefully, have deleted all that mail and am ready to play. Time to kiss and make up guys. <==busy body old lady speaking here. HUGS. heheheheh.. There is nothing like typing and watching B7 all at the same time. I'm in seventh heaven.....and speaking of 7th heaven. Just finished the Anita Blake Vampire Hunter book, Burnt Offerings. Great!. Take care and thanks again, Avona for caring. It really means a lot. Tramila Teleport me now, Vila. It's time for a little fun. --------- Charter Member and Pres. of V.I.C.E. Vila's Intimately Corruptable Element Tramila@aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 07 Apr 1998 00:26:47 PDT From: "Don Trower" To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: Re: [B7L] DSV 1 or 2 Message-ID: <19980407072647.3638.qmail@hotmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain MTPW (My Two Penny Worth) DSV2 and System controlled crew are doing battle somewhere, the situation goes against them, DSV2 is damaged, life support off-line the crew teleport out leaving Zen to control the automatics and maintain security while repairs are carried out, then return itself to base. Why Zen accepts Blake and co. is beyond me unless Zen assumes the System is lost, or Zen it self is damaged. Or DSV2 was a decoy in a System plot else where and just wandered off by itself. Don. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 07 Apr 1998 17:40:11 +1000 From: Bill Billingsley To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: Re: [B7L] DSV 1 or 2 Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980407174011.00694ac0@rabbit> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 00:26 7/04/98 PDT, Don wrote: > Why >Zen accepts Blake and co. is beyond me unless Zen assumes the System is >lost, or Zen it self is damaged. > Or has an in-built sense of salvage rights. (The hallucinogenic defence mechanism wasn't necessarily anything to do with Zen, just as the teleport isn't) -------------------------------------------------------- The Loch Mess Monster (occaisionally mistaken as Bill Billingsley) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 09:32:44 +0100 From: "Jenni-Alison" To: "B7 Lysator" Subject: Re: [B7L] Good news and bad news Message-Id: <199804070834.KAA22531@samantha.lysator.liu.se> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dangermouse wrote: > I dunno - but what Colin said above ain't true anyway - the Beeb does > indeed use proofreaders, and I should know! At least, they do for Dr Who... What Colin was refering to was the question of why a B7 person "in the know" wasn't invited to check over the play for blatant mis-characterisation or continuity errors ("do you copy"). Brian said that he met resistance trying to get someone "non-BBC" to read over the play until after it was broadcast, and he admitted it was a serious error not to push that barrier. Jenni ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Apr 98 10:18 BST-1 From: lucydennis@cix.compulink.co.uk (Dennis Collin) To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: Re: [B7L] Deliverance pros & cons Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199804070406.EAA08113@rock103.genie.net> There's been a lot of traffic on the subject of Deliverance, and criticism of the con. I think one thing that should be pointed out is that Diva's original comments were to Kathryn Andersen's very negative review. Other reviews of and comments of the con, such as yours, Sarah, have been much more well balanced and have been specific about the problems you perceived, rather than nitpicking. To be honest, Kathryn's review was quite upsetting to those of us who had worked so hard to make the con work, so try and see some of Diva's comments in that light. And remember, it takes 2 (or more) to flame. Kathryn answered honest comments with a fair amount of, shall we say, passion of her own, but with not very much substance, and has stated that she doesn't want to reply to any of my comments on her report. Should I take it that she accepts that most of her complaints were not truly valid? > 2) The attitude of some of the con personnel, before, during, and > after. For instance, the person I tried to say thanks to as I was > leaving on Sunday snapped at me. Yes, I understand that the concom > were all horrendously busy, but many people do manage to maintain > basic courtesy even under stress. I'm really sorry that you felt that anyone was rude to you. Without knowing any details of the conversation, I can only assume (as Ivanova would say) that the person in question was in the middle of a hundred things, all of them annoying, and that their snapping at you was inadvertent. As for the behaviour of con staff in general, I know that I stopped and helped someone whenever they had a query, even when I was on the way to deal with another event. My husband, who was Gareth's liaison, still spent the time that he wasn't carrying pints around helping anyone that asked. (And was very gratified by the thanks that he received). On a completely different note, does anyone know if it's true that the MC at the con, Gary Russell, once starred as Dick in ITV's Famous Five series back in the late 70s, early 80s? Lucy ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 10:32:52 +0100 (BST) From: Rob Clother To: B7 mailing list Subject: Re: [B7L] Star spotting Message-ID: Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII > > Oh dear, yet another deluded soul. Blake rules Blake's 7. Everyone knows > > that. :-) > Yeh. That's why he misplaced his ship and crew for years, ended up > having no notion who he could trust on the worst planet in the > Federation and got shot up my his former 2nd in command. Great > rulership. ;) (kidding, kidding!) Well, you know. We all make mistakes... ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 07 Apr 1998 19:33:20 +1000 From: Jeremy Riley To: Blakes 7 mailing list Subject: Re: [B7L] Star spotting Message-ID: <3529F2E0.385CA415@netspeed.com.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Rob Clother wrote: > > AVON still rules Blake's 7!!!!! > > Oh dear, yet another deluded soul. Blake rules Blake's 7. Everyone knows > that. :-) > > -- Rob I'm sorry to say that if it wasn't for Orac, Blakes 7 wouldn't be half as good. And on that note, does anyone know where I can get schematics or other info (or some good pics, I have a few) of the greatest computer ever? -- Regards Jeremy Riley Computer Games World cgw@netspeed.com.au www.netspeed.com.au/cgw ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 12:01:53 +0200 From: "Nelly Meijerink" To: Subject: [B7L] Too hot Message-Id: <199804071020.MAA26243@Njord.bart.nl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > I've been trying to think of a way to say this, but it just keeps >coming out pompous and sorrowful. So -- I hate flame wars. It's been fun, >guys, but enough is enough. > >Catch ya later, >Sandy S > But surely this thing between Diva and Kathryn et.al. is no reason to leave the list, is it? Look upon it as a passing incident. I've been lurking on this list for about six months now and most of the time it's been great fun. I never even knew what flaming was and so now I've been witnessing a real flame war? I must admit I'm a bit of a deviant for I find it all quite amusing.....:-)) Nelly (retreating into lurkdom and into my bathroom where I' m desparately trying to stick tiles to the wall) PS Hi Hanneke! ********************************************************** "Two birds inseparable companions perch on the same tree. One eats the fruit the other looks on. The first bird is our individual self, feeding on the pleasures and pains of this world; The other is the universal Self, silently witnessing all." Mundaka Upanishad ********************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: 07 Apr 1998 12:16:06 +0200 From: Calle Dybedahl To: Subject: Re: [B7L] Too hot Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII "Nelly Meijerink" writes: > I never even knew what flaming was and so now I've been witnessing a > real flame war? More like a mild skirmish. -- Calle Dybedahl, UNIX Sysadmin qdtcall@esavionics.se http://www.lysator.liu.se/~calle/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 11:18:29 +0100 (BST) From: Rob Clother To: B7 mailing list Subject: Re: [B7L] Star spotting Message-ID: Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII > > Oh dear, yet another deluded soul. Blake rules Blake's 7. Everyone knows > > that. :-) > > > > -- Rob > > I'm sorry to say that if it wasn't for Orac, Blakes 7 wouldn't be half as > good. Hm. Orac's 7. Doesn't have quite the same ring to it, does it? ;-) -- Rob ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 11:36:58 +0100 (BST) From: Iain Coleman To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: [B7L] Con-structive criticism Message-Id: Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII I had a thoroughly enjoyable time at Deliverance, and I'd like to thank all those involved. There are a couple of points I'd like to raise, not because they seriously annoyed me, but because I think other con organisers might want to bear them in mind. Communication makes a big difference. I think we all understand that things go wrong, especially at a large event (problems grow nonlinearly with the number of people involved), and are generally happy to cut the staff a bit of slack _if we know what's going on_. It's when you're standing around for ages, not knowing what's happening or how much longer you'll be waiting, that you start to feel frustrated. Some stewards did make an effort to keep the impatient multitudes informed, and this was greatly appreciated, but I think it should have been the general policy, not left up to the initiative of the stewards. I appreciate that when you're running around like a blue-arsed fly trying to sort out some impending disaster, the last thing you want to do is wander around telling the hordes all your problems, but it really does help keep them happy. Redundancy in communication helps a great deal. Having things like the video schedule and the announcements board duplicated around the venue would have helped people keep track of what was going on. In addition, some points (like the workshop tickets business) were rather ambiguous, and could have been clarified by being repeated in different words. Perhaps a big notice at reception giving the times of ticketed events, and the time tickets would be available. Lastly, the bar. It was great that they kept serving till the last waster had crawled off to bed (Note: if you realise that even Gareth Thomas isn't still up drinking, that's a Big Hint that it's bedtime). However, they didn't really seem to be geared up for sudden hourly rushes of hundreds of thirsty fans. It's maybe worth discussing this with the venue beforehand, so they can assess their staffing levels. (Of course, maybe this was done but the hotel just didn't get it right.) Oh, and I know there are many many factors to consider in choosing a venue, but I just want to ask future con organisers to please at least take the quality of the beer into account. That Worthington's Smoothflow or whatever was minging. OK, I'm nitpicking, I'll stop it. To reiterate: thanks to all concerned for a very enjoyable weekend. I hope that other con organisers can learn from the things that Deliverance got right, as well as those things that didn't quite work out. Iain ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 22:18:19 +1000 From: Kathryn Andersen To: "Blake's 7 list" Subject: Re: [B7L] Deliverance pros & cons Message-ID: <19980407221819.09466@welkin.apana.org.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii On Tue, Apr 07, 1998 at 10:18:00AM +0000, Dennis Collin wrote: > To be honest, Kathryn's review was quite upsetting to those of us who had > worked so hard to make the con work, so try and see some of Diva's > comments in that light. And remember, it takes 2 (or more) to flame. > Kathryn answered honest comments with a fair amount of, shall we say, > passion of her own, but with not very much substance, and has stated that > she doesn't want to reply to any of my comments on her report. Should I > take it that she accepts that most of her complaints were not truly valid? No. I just didn't want to fan the flames. -- _--_|\ | Kathryn Andersen / \ | http://connexus.apana.org.au/~kat \_.--.*/ | #include "std/disclaimer.h" v | ------------| Melbourne -> Victoria -> Australia -> Southern Hemisphere Maranatha! | -> Earth -> Sol -> Milky Way Galaxy -> Universe ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 09:35:28 -0500 From: "Reuben Herfindahl" To: , "JMR" Subject: Re: [B7L] More on Julia Jones re. DELIVERANCE Message-ID: <002601bd6232$6a1cc880$660114ac@misnt> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit -----Original Message----- From: JMR To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Date: Monday, April 06, 1998 6:57 PM Subject: [B7L] More on Julia Jones re. DELIVERANCE Lots of point, counter point. De-lurking for a bit here. Hate to bud in on this. I admit I know nothing about all the hard work that goes into Cons, and how sometimes that doesn't work. I do know that I loved hearing all the con-reports. I live in the US and simply can't afford to go. I really appreciate all the reports, as others have said it helps make up for not actually being there. However, I don't (and I think most of the rest of this list doesn't) care to hear about the bickering and little fights, and who's toes got stepped on. Please let's keep this as a positive forum, not a yelling section. Reuben ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 16:07:36 +0100 From: "Dangermouse" To: "Reuben Herfindahl" Cc: Subject: Re: [B7L] Good news and bad news Message-Id: <199804071558.QAA01935@gnasher.sol.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > From: Reuben Herfindahl > >Oh yeah, and the cop's name in Face Of The Enemy should seem familiar! > > That one I did catch, I wondered for a moment if it might not be > coincidence, and quickly decided it probably wasn't. Thanks for pointing > out all the references. It's deliberate, but I was quite embarrassed when Chris himself found out! (he seemed flattered though) There's another one I forgot in Mission Impractical - it's Colin Baker's Doctor, and at one point he does start quoting Bayban while trying to prove he's a hard man to some people... > Also, I was wondering ,if it would be possible, if I sent you a copy of Face > along with return envelope and postage if you could sign it? Yeah, OK. ------------------------------ Date: 7 Apr 1998 09:51:57 -0700 From: "Kinkade.Carol" To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se, "Sandy" Subject: [B7L] It's too hot in here for me Message-ID: >Sandy S wrote: > I've been trying to think of a way to say this, but it just >keeps coming out pompous and sorrowful. So -- I hate flame wars. It's >been fun, guys, but enough is enough. Well said Sandy, and I agree. This has been on my mind for a while, too. I love a good, lively, "heated" discussion/disagreement over elements of the show or the characters as much as anyone (I can *always* defend my favorite), but I'm not into flame wars, and there are too many of them here. It's beginning to tarnish my appreciation of Blake's 7. I continue to love and enjoy the show but I'll do it AWAY from any "organized" fandom. It's just too depressing. For the most part, it HAS been fun...and I enjoy and appreciate the friends I have made on the list, but the recent Deliverance "flaming" is just too much. Carol K (sadly unsubbed) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 07 Apr 1998 18:02:57 +0100 GMT From: STEVE.ROGERSON@MCR1.poptel.org.uk To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se, space-city@world.std.com Subject: [B7L] Chaos Message-Id: <498104101MCR1@MCR1.poptel.org.uk> According to this month's Starburst (No 237) in the UK, Jan Chappell and Michael Keating are to appear in a British made supernatural thriller called Chaos along with Dr Who stars Peter Davidson, Sophie Aldred and Caroline John. Filming is planned to start in the autumn and it will be financed by a share issue that will start in June. Michael Henderson is the director. cheers Steve Rogerson Redemption 99 - The Blakes 7/Babylon 5 convention 26-28 February 1999, Ashford International Hotel, Kent http://www.smof.com/redemption/ "The workers united will never be ignited" Guards! Guards! - Terry Pratchett ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Apr 98 18:05 BST-1 From: lucydennis@cix.compulink.co.uk (Dennis Collin) To: blakes7@lysator.liu.se Subject: Re: [B7L] More on Julia Jones re. DELIVERANCE Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <002601bd6232$6a1cc880$660114ac@misnt> I detect a pattern here. Someone bad-mouths Deliverance on this list. Someone else complains about this and tries to defend Deliverance. First person refuses to discuss any further on the grounds that it might start a flame war. Cool! You get to be unpleasant with no repercussions. If you do it right you can make sure that you look like the reasonable one, and the other poor sod is a vitriolic flamer. I wish I'd thought of it first. Lucy ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 14:33:52 -0400 From: Harriet Monkhouse <101637.2064@compuserve.com> To: "INTERNET:blakes7@lysator.liu.se" Subject: [B7L] Re: Heavy drinking and sleep deprivation - the key to a great weekend Message-ID: <199804071434_MC2-3938-9500@compuserve.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Tom replied to Kathryn: >> Oh, and if you want to know, the pronunciation >>is "Ca-leh" - more or less. Probably less than more! >>No, I made *no* attempt at "Dybedahl"! > >This really needs to be put in the FAQ, you know! Maybe > Calle should bung us a .wav file of him saying it. Several >times. Slowly. It's quite easy really, you just pronounce it "Calle Dybedahl". Harriet ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 22:34:51 +-100 From: Louise Rutter To: "'B7 Lysator'" Subject: [B7L] Deliverance Message-ID: <01BD6275.74DEDC20@host5-99-56-44.btinternet.com> OK, I got in a little late on the discussion, having spent most of the week after Deliverance at a veterinary conference, but IMO Deliverance was one of the better run cons I've been to. There was FAR less rearranging of schedules and events than at Who's 7 94 and 96 (where, if you didn't watch the scribbled notice boards at Reception, you didn't have a clue what was happening), and the queues were much shorter than at Wolf in Blackpool (though I suspect that was due to fewer attendees rather than better organisation). The only problem I had was with the ticketing arrangements for the alternative programme - I was rather disappointed to be told on Friday that Gareth and Jackie's panel was for ticketholders only when this had not been made clear, though I understand the reasoning now that it has been explained. Even the stewards at reception on Saturday didn't seem sure which events were ticketed when asked. I _do_ know that every single time I saw Julia Jones she was in the middle of desperately trying to sort something at the last minute, and I would like to thank her immensely for her hard work. Whether her problems were self-induced or down to the ConCom I am in no position to know, and I do not wish to become involved. Overall, Deliverance was well done - every single con can be expected to have events run overtime, and any other probs were minor from an attendees POV. I think everyone involved in organising it should be congratulated. Louise PS I agree with the general consensus around here that if Diva is going to level personal criticisms she should at least say who she is and what her personal role was. Every other person who has commented has done so. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1998 12:40:59 +1200 From: "Graham, Gregory" To: "'B7'" Subject: RE: [B7L] Star spotting Message-ID: <710458B7BCD3D011897D0000F8003AB7816894@invex.agresearch.cri.nz> Content-Type: text/plain > > AVON still rules Blake's 7!!!!! > > > Oh dear, yet another deluded soul. Blake rules Blake's 7. Everyone > knows > that. :-) > > -- Rob > Even Avon admitted it, otherwise he would never have lost The Liberator or gone to GP. Greg ps "the facts, though interesting, are irrelevant." -------------------------------- End of blakes7-d Digest V98 Issue #105 **************************************